.jpg)
The Edit Alaverdyan Podcast
Welcome to "The Edit Alaverdyan Podcast," the podcast where insightful conversations unfold, and the depth of the human mind is explored. In each episode, I sit down with a diverse range of individuals—thinkers, innovators, and captivating personalities—who share their unique insights and experiences. Together, we embark on a journey of discovery, unraveling the complexities of the human psyche and uncovering the untold truths that influence our thoughts, emotions, and behaviors.
The Edit Alaverdyan Podcast
Kimberly Shannon Murphy | Trauma, Forgiveness, Survival | The Edit Alaverdyan Podcast #26
What if the key to unlocking your potential lies in confronting your deepest traumas? From a harrowing childhood to the glitz and grit of Hollywood, Kimberly Shannon Murphy's story is nothing short of extraordinary. Join us as we sit down with this award-winning stuntwoman and hear about her incredible journey, the physical and emotional battles she faced, and the resilient spirit that propelled her to double for stars like Cameron Diaz.
Throughout this episode, we delve into Kimberly's personal healing process, discussing the profound impact of childhood abuse and the complex dynamics within her family. Her candid revelations about using writing as a therapeutic tool, and the emotional rollercoaster that followed the publication of her book, offer a raw glimpse into the struggle for authenticity amidst familial pressure. We also touch on the transformative potential of psychedelic therapy in uncovering and addressing deep-seated memories, accentuating the importance of professional support and setting healthy boundaries.
Wrapping up, we address the controversial topic of forgiveness and the necessity of self-acceptance in the path to recovery. Kimberly's insights into connecting with one's inner child, recognizing trauma bonds, and the liberating journey towards living authentically provide invaluable lessons for anyone grappling with their past. Don't miss this powerful conversation that underscores the nuanced and often challenging road to healing and self-discovery.
You know I struggle. Now I'm still in therapy, I'm still doing so much work on myself, because you can't have the childhood I had and all of a sudden snap your fingers and be the perfect mother and not do any work on yourself. It's just not possible. This pedophilia stuff that's happening nowadays and the sexual abuse or this form of trauma is to go through the pain. It's the only way. You can run as fast as you want from it or try to jump over it, and it's always.
Speaker 2:That's not how it works you know, if you're traumatized to that level, you run the heck out of there.
Speaker 1:You know, we all knew the abuse happened, we all knew we had the memories, but there was no real conversation going on between us. That makes you feel crazy, because you're like why aren't we talking about this and why does everyone want to push it away and why does nobody want to say that today's podcast was?
Speaker 2:one of the most deepest conversations that I've had with a guest so far. Not only was it meaningful because it was about trauma and survival, but it was an extremely heartwarming and I did feel, of course, sadness as well, but it was very heartwarming to sit next to someone who's so genuine and is able to still smile after such heart-wrenching trauma in her life. I'm talking about Kimberly Shannon Murphy. Kimberly is an award-winning Hollywood stuntwoman who has been featured in more than 100 films and is the stuntwoman for Cameron Diaz. She's also an author, a wife and an amazing mother.
Speaker 2:Today's topic was all trauma-related and resiliency. How did somebody go through something so traumatic and is still able to smile, hold on a smile and be such a genuinely kind, giving and good person? Today's topic was not only the trauma related portion of it, but it was also how to heal and what does healing look like, because essentially it's different for every single person out there. I have to say that this episode in general is a trigger warning for anybody that has been through trauma, but I highly recommend for everybody to take some kind of life lesson from Kimberly, because she is such a light in the room and just lights up the entire room as she walks in and is so wise and is so kind and is just really, really settled and is a really mature individual. I have learned so much from her, just from this hour-long conversation, and I know you guys will, too, enjoy this episode with Kimberly, and thank you for joining.
Speaker 2:Make sure to subscribe, kimberly. It's so nice to have you, so nice to meet you. Oh my God, yes, finally. First of all, you have such an awesome team. Thank you, and I'm so grateful that you were able to accept my invitation, and it's literally an honor to sit in front of you and have such meaningful conversation. You are somebody that's so important, and so I'm very grateful for today.
Speaker 1:Thank you Of course.
Speaker 2:So you're a Hollywood stunned woman Tell us.
Speaker 1:How did you get into that? I was a professional acrobat and dancer. Through my 20s or kind of started, actually through my childhood, was dancing and doing gymnastics. And then in my early 20s I started working for a company out of New York called Anti-Gravity which did a lot of like Cirque du Soleil type things. So I performed all over the world doing that and a lot of the performers that I worked with were starting to get into stunts, my goodness. And they were like you should send your stuff in. You're such a great size Because a lot of that work is not only the talent but matching up to an actor and being a similar size to an actor right that you're doubling. So I sent my stuff out to George Aguilar, who was kind of running New York at the time, and he called me like five days later, a week later, he's like do you want to come down to my office? I'm starting a movie with Uma Thurman and you'd be a great double for her. And that was my first job and I never stopped working Is it exciting.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's exciting. It has its, like every job, and painful, I mean. Yeah, it has its moments for sure. I've seen some of your stories.
Speaker 2:Oh, my goodness.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but it's been a really great career and I've been really blessed to have been connected with the women that I've been able to connect with over the years, and so I feel really lucky.
Speaker 2:How does it feel working with Cameron Diaz? No-transcript, and it made me want to be a better woman, would you say that that was the birth of the book as well, is around that time when you met her, or this is something that you've been thinking about?
Speaker 1:I was writing already when I met her, but not in a. It was more like an exorcism, I like to call it, and she'll call it that too, because she read all of those pages that I was writing at the time and it was more of me just kind of needing to get everything out and there was no shape to it really. And then once my career sort of took off, I just kind of left it and came back to it.
Speaker 2:When I came back to it four years ago, three years ago, and it was the right time to do that, Do you feel content now that the book is out and you're able to kind of portray what you felt on paper?
Speaker 1:on paper. It's been a really interesting journey in the sense of, since the book came out, the things that have happened within my family system because I spoke my truth were things that I did not anticipate to happen. So, along with being really proud about what I put out into the world, there is a lot of grief around it as well. Not grief that I don't accept and I wouldn't have it any other way, but it's definitely grief.
Speaker 2:Would you feel comfortable telling the audience a little bit about what has taken place in your life and what the book is about essentially?
Speaker 1:My maternal grandfather, my mother's father, was a psychopath and he abused his children and in turn abused me and countless others, and he started probably when I was about three and he died when I was 11. And then that kind of threw me into a lot of things in my adolescence and early adult life eating disorders, cutting getting into one bad relationship after another, to that place of the never ending circle of or cycle of abuse in your own life that I was allowing in my life because of what my parents had allowed in my life.
Speaker 2:What took place?
Speaker 1:How was he abusive, kimberly, if you don't mind sharing with us? It's interesting because I kept a lot out of the book as far as details about what happened to me, because the goal of writing it I wrote it for survivors and the goal for me was to write a story that survivors could connect with, that they can understand the severity of what happened without me having to detail what happened to me, and I feel like I did a really we did a really good job. Me and my writer did a really good job of doing that. But he was extremely you know, sexual abuse, physical abuse, emotional abuse. He was also very violent with me as well and I'm sure, as you know, working with patients like this, the memories when something has happened to you for that long of a time and there are so many memories to have I'm still having memories Like things are still coming to me at this point in my life.
Speaker 1:Is it hard to talk about these things? It's never been hard for me to talk about, actually, which is interesting because I know for a lot of people like me it is very difficult, but I never felt that way. It was almost like when I could say it out loud. It was such a release for me that it felt like I could finally make some sense of my life, so I never felt like it was difficult to talk about, if anything. The more people I could talk to about it especially when I was first speaking about it like the more I felt validated and safe, even though I wasn't. It made me feel like okay, there, okay, I can grab onto this thing. Now I know what this thing is, that happened to me, and I can start trying to put the puzzle together as to why I'm behaving in certain ways and why my family's behaving in certain ways, and why all of this trauma was just occurring in my family system.
Speaker 2:That's interesting when you say it happened from ages three to 11, is that correct? Were you like aware that these things were happening? Or I mean, like it's at a certain point, when the trauma stops, when the abuse stops, you become more conscious of it. Did you know that these things were not normal as a child? Did you feel that? Because sometimes you feel you're like okay, is this the norm? Is this what love is? Maybe this is what it is, but there's people who feel completely the opposite of that. What were your thoughts when the trauma or the abuse was happening?
Speaker 1:It was honestly, really terrifying for me.
Speaker 1:Obviously, my grandfather was, like I said, very violent, so he did try to kill me.
Speaker 1:I don't know if he would have ever gone through with it, but it felt like he was trying to kill me, like suffocating me, drowning me, things of that nature. I don't know if it was like a game to him that he would have ever gone through with it. You know what I mean? Yeah, but that's what was happening. So I was really terrified for my life and it was extremely confusing because this was happening under a roof where my mother was, my father was, my aunts were, my grandmother was, and nothing was being done, and so I feel like it was almost like I was living in like a dollhouse almost. When I think about it now, that's what it feels like, like we were all like living in this, because it happened in his home mainly, and we were all just like playing this part and living in this house and I knew it wasn't right and I knew that it was causing me pain and I knew that that couldn't be love. But also, with that said, I didn't know anything else.
Speaker 2:I'm kind of shocked at this. Your parents everybody was in the house while this was happening Did they know that this was happening?
Speaker 1:The closer I get to the truth in my adulthood, the more I think that they did know what was happening, especially my mother.
Speaker 2:And how do you come to that conclusion?
Speaker 1:I remember my mother walking in one time and seeing him abusing me and he told her to leave and she did.
Speaker 1:Oh, my goodness yeah to leave and she did oh, my goodness, yeah. And for me, when I had this memory, my mom was still in my life at the time and I remember we were out to dinner this was probably four years ago. Was the book out? I don't think the book was out yet and I said to her I remembered that you walked in on your father and me and she didn't even skip a beat and she said oh, I'm not surprised.
Speaker 2:Meaning this happened to her.
Speaker 1:She was abused her whole childhood. But she said to me I'm not surprised, and I was like you're not surprised, and she said it never made sense to me that I didn't check on you, because I was always checking on you girls and it never made sense to me. So I'm not surprised that I did see it, but she I don't know that my mom's ever actually been in her body Like she's so disassociated from herself, and that obviously started at a really young age and my grandfather was very good at grooming all of us and her and her siblings, and so I don't know that my mother ever mothered me or my siblings from a place of being in her actual body, and I do believe that.
Speaker 2:Do you have a relationship with your mom right now? No, how has that?
Speaker 1:been Really hard. It's been really hard. I think what happened was, once the book came out, she was, you know, she signed off on me writing the book. I mean through my publisher, she signed you know all this paperwork basically, you know, admitting that this was all true information that I was writing about. But I think when it came out and then, because I do have somewhat of a platform and all the doctors that so lovingly supported me through all this and stood behind me and all of the interviews I did, I think it got really scary for her.
Speaker 1:And the healthier I got and the more I was talking to, you know, gabor and Dr Romney and Dr Perry and Dr Schwartz and all these doctors and starting to do work with them, the more I was remembering and I don't think my mom could handle what I was remembering my family's very content with being in a place of yeah, we know this happened like, this is what happened, but we're moving on, we're not going to, we're not living in it, but you are, we're not living in it, we're just going to move on. We have kids now. We're not going to revisit, but to me it's necessary for me to revisit what happened to me and what happened in that house, Because if I don't, I'm just going to pass that on to my daughter, not in the form of sexual abuse, but in the form of some sort of abuse. It bleeds.
Speaker 2:The trauma bleeds in the family. I agree.
Speaker 1:And you can't be. You know I struggle. Now I'm still in therapy, I'm still doing so much work on myself because you can't have the childhood I had and all of a sudden snap your fingers and be the perfect mother and not do any work on yourself. It's just not possible. It's just not how it works and that is not something I ever wanted to do and my family always seemed to just be okay with that and that's not who I ever was.
Speaker 2:I'm so happy that you're speaking up about that. I think it takes such a courageous person. I feel that it takes a courageous person. I feel that it takes a courageous person because it's true, like when you start speaking about it, then you become the enemy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I never realized how many people you know that was happening to until.
Speaker 1:I started speaking up and until I started hearing from all these strangers and you know getting emails or letters, you know notes on Instagram or whatever, about how many people are living in these family systems whether it was their father that abused them, their brother that abused them, their grandfather, their grandmother, their mother, whatever have you and their siblings, and everybody hates them or has scapegoated them because they are speaking out and telling the truth. And it's a really lonely thing, journey right.
Speaker 1:It's a really lonely journey and the sad part is it's like you came into this world as an innocent child and didn't ask for any of this and you're born into an abusive family that abuses you and then, when you try to do something positive with it and heal and work through it, you get ostracized by the people that did it to you in the first place. But the one thing that I truly feel and that I've been feeling my father passed away about three months ago two months ago. I'm sorry, thank you, and that was an interesting journey for me because nobody called me, so I didn't hear from any of my sisters. My mother didn't call. Nobody called me. I did not know that he passed away. I heard from my husband. Somebody called my husband and my mother apparently was at the funeral and at the wake.
Speaker 1:My parents divorced when I was 18. And it was just such a level of inhumanity to be able to do that to somebody, no matter what has happened, to not think that I deserve a phone call to know that my father's dead or that he was in hospice at his wake and his funeral, and to go to the church and do all of like the godly things and to be stabbing me in the back and to be acting like I don't exist. I think that was the toughest thing. Right, it's like I don't exist, but what I realized is I never did in their minds or in their world I didn't exist. I didn't exist to my parents, I didn't exist to my siblings, and the minute I got loud about that was the minute I was very quickly pushed out of the family. So the reality is I can say that I've lost them all, but the truth is I never had them to begin with yes, I was going to say that it sounds like that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that is just. I don't. I don't even have words to share, because it's what do you? I mean there isn't anything you can say to a person. You can just sit with them and like sit with their presence and like respect their story. But that's that's so sad. Yeah, it's sad, it's very sad for for a little beautiful girl to go through. Yeah, what are? Do you feel like you still have flashbacks and memories of? Are they vivid?
Speaker 1:They're very strong now, when I have them.
Speaker 2:They're very clear.
Speaker 1:They're very clear now.
Speaker 2:Why do you think they're much clearer now?
Speaker 1:I feel like I've been doing a lot of psychedelic work the past three years. That's changed my life. Yeah, like completely changed my life. It's like therapy in fast forward kind of, in a way. But I do feel and when I talk about it, I do like to be really clear that I do it with a doctor, I do it under you know, because it is being done in the world right now in a lot of ways that I don't think is necessarily helpful or the right ways to do it.
Speaker 2:It's like you know, oh, let's all go in the jungle and take a bunch of drugs and you know let's do ayahuasca in someone's house and it's like you have to be super mindful and careful. Yeah, you need a guide for sure.
Speaker 1:You need a guide, you need intentions. You need to be doing therapy before, after, around it. You don't need to be doing it every week. I do it twice a year.
Speaker 2:Pretty much Therapy or psychedelic, the journeys, my journeys, yeah.
Speaker 1:Nice, and that has brought my memories to be really, really clear, and I also feel like that has to do with when we connect with our inner child and we are allowing them, and that's what I always go into my journeys with.
Speaker 1:Whatever you need to show me, I'm willing to see it and, without fail, every time it's like I feel like she's like here, here, here, yeah, like she's been holding all of this pain for so long and that we've finally kind of come back to each other. Um, sounds like very woo woo, but no, no, thank.
Speaker 2:But first of all, thank you for being so open and vulnerable to share this I I know it's not easy talking about it, but it does and vulnerable to share this. I know it's not easy talking about it, but it does. It does get easier as time goes on. But I want to ask you a very private question. But you don't have to answer if you don't feel comfortable. Obviously it's your will. What are some core, clear memories that you have of the abuse that just shook you to the core and you're like I can't believe that this guy did this to me?
Speaker 1:I've always had the sexual memories and I've had very, you know kind of here and there about like I would have a memory and there would be like a lot of blood but I could never connect like where they would come from. And so crazy, because in one of my journeys and then afterwards when I was working with Dr Schwartz, my grandfather used to carry a Swiss army knife around with him everywhere and I have like two scars in my mouth that go from back here to the front that are from him, and many other places on my body.
Speaker 2:Meaning he used to cut you with the knife. Yeah, oh my goodness, I'm so sorry.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and that was the memory when I had that that that's probably been a year since I had it. That really shook me Because I've always had the scars in my mouth and I've always known they were there, but I never even wondered what they were. I was never like that's so weird, why do I have to? I mean, they're knife scars, literally. Yeah. And I think a few days later I actually called my childhood dentist Because I was like the thing that's so hard for me to wrap my head around again is like how the fuck did nobody know? Which brings me to there's no way that nobody knew. And that's been the hardest thing for me, because it's just brought me to this place where there's no way that they didn't know. There's no way that nobody knew that my mouth was bleeding. There's absolutely no way.
Speaker 1:And so I called my dentist and he was still practicing and actually Holly was sitting with me when I called him and it was a really bizarre phone call and I'm not sure why he thought I called.
Speaker 1:He's like oh, this is Kimberly, you know, because he still works in the town that I grew up in and I'm sure my dad was very, very proud of my career and spoke about me a lot to people. So I'm sure he knew that I had what I was doing with my life and my career. And I just said to him I just need to know, I have two scars in my mouth and I just need to know if you ever saw them in my mouth, because I'm just you know there was abuse that was going on when I was a child and I'm trying to just puzzle this together for my own sanity. And he very quickly turned and he was like well, if you had scars on your cheeks? I never said my cheeks to him. He said if you had scars on your cheeks I would have just talked to your mom. It was probably just from you biting the sides of your mouth. But I never said my cheeks to him and I said that.
Speaker 2:I said I never said my cheeks to you and he's like well, I don't have your records anymore.
Speaker 1:And he basically just got off the phone with me and you know it wasn't an answer, but it was an answer. So I'm like okay, so you saw something in my mouth and you obviously had a conversation with my mom. My mom I'm sure never remembered but yeah, that was the biggest thing for me, that was the hardest. That's been the hardest one for me to swallow, for obvious reasons, Did your dad know?
Speaker 1:I don't think my dad. I knew that I was being abused because I do believe my dad would have killed him. I do believe that my dad was in the Marines, he was in Vietnam and my dad was a. You know and I say this often my parents were two traumatized kids that got married and had kids. I mean they were traumatized kids that got married and had kids. And that's why I mean they were traumatized kids that got married and had kids and that's why the work that we do on ourselves is so important and doing that before we have kids is so important.
Speaker 1:And my parents got married in their early 20s and my mom came from a home where her dad was a psychopath and her mom was a narcissistic psychopath and my dad didn't come from the best family either and then went to Vietnam when he was 18 for two years and he was a mind sweeper and saw his friends get blown up in front of him, it's like. And then he came home and got married and had kids and became a really big drinker. So when we were at parties it was kind of like my dad was, you know, not around and drinking and he loves my grandfather, which has also been honest to me, it's like I don't. I feel like I wish that I could go back and speak to the dead which you know I have done in my journeys actually.
Speaker 2:How was?
Speaker 1:that. It's really great. It was really that was. I had like all my ancestors in my living actually. But how was that? It's really, it's really great. It was really, that was I had like all my ancestors in my living room. At one point. But you know, for no one to know who he was, I just don't believe it. There's just no way. There's just no way. My mom was one of six. My aunt, who I write about, who's I write about in the book, and also her writing, is in the book. She was the first one to come forward about him. When she was nine, she told my grandmother that he had been touching her, her own father.
Speaker 1:And my grandmother confronted him and he denied it and everything just went away, but he continued to do it and then my aunt, you know, put a lot on herself, like blamed herself for everything else that happened when she was just a child who wasn't believed, basically, and it just continued. Instead of someone putting him in jail, which is what should have happened, Is there somewhere in your heart that you believe that this could?
Speaker 2:somebody could have done this also to your grandfather and this could have been maybe like a learned behavior from him? Totally Right, yeah, I always think about that when I hear about stories with clients or individuals, friends, and I'm like, oh my God, you know this pedophilia stuff that's happening nowadays and the sexual abuse or this form of abuse. It could be that these things were also done to them. Totally yeah.
Speaker 1:And I know that didn't, and I might misspeak here, but didn't Freud write about a lot about that? It was normal to have sex with your children and all of that sort of stuff.
Speaker 2:Yeah, jordan Peterson talks about that all the time. Yeah, all the time he did. He was a freak himself.
Speaker 1:Yeah, in a way, and I'm sure he was if he had children or he was doing it. So he was making it okay to behave in this way, Exactly.
Speaker 2:Well, there's history in the books that there was sexual abuse in his family. They can't pinpoint who did who and to what, but there's a lot of history behind Freud and sexual abuse definitely. Yeah, yeah, like a learned behavior.
Speaker 1:I definitely think. I'm sure you know my family always sort of told one story like oh, you know, when this certain uncle came over to the house, your grandfather always would lock himself or put himself under the kitchen sink. No way. So I'm sure that I'm sure he was abused. Yeah, I don't care, it doesn't matter.
Speaker 2:But absolutely I'm sure he was. But, yeah, yeah, to kind of put the puzzle together yeah, you're like what happened to you? Yeah, and why would you have to do the same thing? Did he only do this to you? Do you feel like? Or there there was like other Many others. Many others, like siblings and things. Yeah, as you say, they've kind of forgotten about it.
Speaker 1:I don't think they've forgotten about it, I just think they don't want to come forward.
Speaker 1:Or you know, look, everyone has their own journeys and just because I decided to write a book and speak about it does not mean that anybody else in my family needs to do that. Everyone needs to handle it the way that they feel like they need to handle it. I do feel like they aren't handling it because if they were handling it, I'd have a relationship with them. That's right, because they would be showing up in my life in a very different way. This should connect people together, right? You would think so. Right, it's interesting. The truth is an interesting thing. Yeah, when it's spoken to people. Yeah, that's what I always thing. Yeah, when it's spoken to people.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's what I always say. Yeah, Truth was so respected. You know, back in the day, what happened to you know where are we now that truth is punishable? Now, I think?
Speaker 1:the trauma is overriding the truth for a lot of people, yeah, that they've been so traumatized that they do believe and their shame is so big and so massive that they do believe that if they go there they'll never come back. And that was something that somebody in my family said to me at one point. I feel like if I go there, I'm never going to come back, like I'm not going to live through it, I'm not going to be able to live my life. But the truth of the matter is you're never living your life if you're not living in your truth.
Speaker 2:Just denial all the time, right. So this is my question to you how are you still such a wonderful, kind person after experiencing? Because there's always two sides, like in the movies, right, there's always the hero and the villain and they don't have that much of a different of a life story. But you choose your life path and who you want to become. You're so kind and you're so loving and you're so helpful. What led you to be this person? Because he could have done the opposite, could have you know?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think it's who I've always been. I think he tried to take it from me, but I won, yes, you did.
Speaker 1:You kicked ass. Yeah, yeah, yeah, and I think it's a choice. Yeah, you know it's a choice and, for whatever reason, I do feel like I was born with this power inside me, this strength inside me that I've always had, and I do. You know, when you have children, you see it, it's like your parenting obviously has a big effect on your child, right? But our children are born and they're all different. They all have their own something about them that has nothing to do with you, and I think that that was my something, that I always had, this strength that is now carried over into my adult life.
Speaker 1:And I do believe that I was put here to break this cycle for my family, and I do believe I was put here to help others with my story, because there are so many people suffering in silence that have been abused by family members. It happens so much. It's like 90% of people that have been sexually abused is by a family member, yes, and it's so hard for them to speak on it because they still have a relationship with that family member or they don't want to upset anybody, or they don't want Christmas to be ruined or all of these things. And so, if I can and I know I have already helped people like me. It makes it all worth it for me.
Speaker 2:I think that, also being a cycle breaker, it is such a terrifying thing in the beginning it is. Was your journey scary for you? Yeah?
Speaker 1:It's less scary now that I understand it, but in the beginning I feel like you don't understand it. In the beginning it's just a bunch of confusing things that you're just trying to figure out. And writing the book and, I will say, all the doctors that have just stood by me through all of it I've learned so much from them. Before I started writing, I didn't even know who Gabor was, which is crazy, because he's obviously like top trauma doctor in the world. I obviously have top trauma and I didn't know who he was. And so the fact that I've been able to connect with him and that he, you know, read my story and endorsed my story and all the other doctors read my story and endorsed my story and all the other doctors for them to be able to put a name to the things that went on in my family changed my life. What was that name?
Speaker 1:Well, dr Romney, our podcast was the first podcast I did and she was just like, oh yeah, this is a dysfunctional family system. This is an enmeshed family system. This is a toxic family system. This is what scapegoating looks like. This is what happens when a perpetrator grooms. She just had all of the facts and everything that she said. I was like, yeah, yeah, that's my family and it just made me feel so much less crazy and that was really incredible to be able to have that from her.
Speaker 2:You said something very interesting. You said it made me. Putting the name to the situation made you feel less crazy. What made you feel?
Speaker 1:crazy. Your family makes you feel crazy For me anyway, because I it was always like, okay, kim, we get it, it's like enough, we don't need to keep going back there. But we actually haven't gone back there yet. I was even thinking about that in the car the other day. I thought I never had a real conversation with my family you know, my parents and my siblings about exactly that. How the heck did this like how the heck, did this happen?
Speaker 1:Like I want some answers. It was always very, you know, we all knew the abuse happened, we all knew we had the memories, but there was no real conversation going on between us, and so that makes you feel crazy, because you're like why aren't we talking about this and why does everyone want to push it away and why does nobody want to look at it? When I was so the opposite. So, being out of it now, I can see things through a lens of what they truly were and are, instead of what I always wanted them to be. I wanted my mom to be this person, I wanted my dad to be this person, and they just weren't that person. I don't think they didn't love me. I think they didn't love themselves.
Speaker 2:I mean, how are they going to love you if they don't love themselves? That's so interesting. It's that dismissiveness, constantly being dismissed, that makes you feel like, okay, maybe I'm the narcissist, maybe I'm the problem, you know, and definitely it's a form of gaslighting in a way too. That's just horrible.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and they get really good at it. The system, like, runs in a very certain way and everyone has their role that they play, and I also think when a person decides to leave, it becomes very disruptive because your role is now gone, so who's going to fill that?
Speaker 2:role.
Speaker 1:And so how are we going to shift and move around? Well, we're all just going to gang up on her, tell everybody she's absolutely crazy and she's, you know, wrote this book. And I, one of my girlfriends, wrote a message to my sisters when my father passed away and said you know, how could you guys not tell Kim, how could you not let her know? And you know, the funny thing is in the family I've always been the, especially once my career, once I started doing really well in my career, we didn't grow up with a lot of money, so it was like I could do all these things now for my family. I could, like my sister wanted to buy a house, like I can help you, I can do, like I was that person. So when my girlfriend wrote them, they wrote back these messages that were I mean to read it was the most and actually Romany read them and she was like that's the biggest form of gaslighting I've ever read in my life.
Speaker 1:I can imagine she's like I cannot even wrap my head around. You know, and it was like basically what they said in the messages was in response to why didn't you tell Kim her father was dead, or let her know where the funeral was, or any of those things was that I broke my dad's heart, basically blaming his death on me? Like you know, kim broke my dad's heart. I've been picking up the pieces of his heart.
Speaker 2:So it's about that. I made it about them.
Speaker 1:Kim, you should have seen this letter that Kim wrote my dad. You know it broke his heart, like you know this just horrible like one thing after another, and I'm like, actually I wrote dad a 10-page letter because my dad had a really hard time listening. So I wrote him a letter to just kind of get everything out that I needed to get out. And then at the end of the letter I said, dad, I want to have a relationship with you. I actually we can heal, but we need to acknowledge these things. It's important in order to have an authentic relationship, which is not what I had with anybody in my family. And so I was just being gaslit that I, you know, killed my father, apparently, you know, from a broken heart which my dad's heart was broken way before I was ever born.
Speaker 1:Do you miss your dad? Yeah, yeah, I miss the dad I didn't have. I miss the dad that I know I could have had if he could have just had the strength to step back and look at things for what they actually were. And he just wasn't strong enough to do that, for whatever reason, and I don't think he thought he deserved it and you know, he ultimately killed himself. I mean he was a massive drinker. He smoked like two packs of cigarettes a day and he died of you know, he had COPD and emphysema and lung cancer. You know all the things. So, yeah, I think that there is that grief in there of not having. I'm like I literally didn't have parents. I was raised by like a wolf tribe or something I don't even know. You know what I mean. I didn't have parents. I didn't have yeah, which form?
Speaker 2:how you're going to have relationships with other people, especially your first relationship is with mom. Yeah, you know mom. So for anybody that's been through trauma, I want to ask this, because everyone's journey is different, but it does. You put boundaries with your families, of course, and sometimes you dismiss family because you don't want to have anything to do with them. It's just too toxic. Then how do you deal with that loneliness? How did you deal with the loneliness of I don't have anyone around me. Everyone's dismissive, no one's acknowledging what has happened?
Speaker 1:The loneliness comes and the grief comes, but the pain goes and so what's more worth it? You know what I mean. It's like I feel like I'm grieving my family that's still alive and it's painful, but it's a different kind of pain. It's an acceptance kind of pain. I can now accept them all for who they are and where they're at, welcome them back into my life at any time, if that was ever to change. My siblings have been through, especially one of my siblings have been through a very similar life that I have and we've just chosen to deal with it in different ways.
Speaker 1:And as soon as she found out, I got the book deal. I told her. I said I got a book deal with Harper Collins and I'm going to write this book and you're not going to be in it. I wouldn't do that to you. It's not my job to tell your story. And I didn't tell her story and I would never tell her story. And she, from that moment on, never spoke to me again, and that was five years ago on. And never spoke to me again, and that was five years ago. But if she was to ever want to come back into my life, because she's done work and because she understands the scope of everything I'm talking about. It would be a different story for me, because we have the same story and we were, because we have the same story and we were. You know, unfortunately all of us grew up in like a trauma bond. There wasn't. It wasn't a real sisterhood or mother daughter or father daughter. It was a complete trauma bond.
Speaker 2:We knew nothing but trauma from the day that we set our feet on this planet? When did you learn that it was a trauma bond? When?
Speaker 1:Dr Romney told me yeah, she's a godsend, she's. I just love her so much.
Speaker 2:I love when people can call it out because it's so important for individuals to know that. You know there's different bonding styles and that could be a form of trauma, Like when you get together and family members only gossip because that's all the relation, Like that's all you have is the gossip. So that's a form of trauma bonding. There's no other way of connecting to the individual.
Speaker 1:Or they're gaslighting each other.
Speaker 2:They're gaslighting each other, spreading rumors about each other with each other, Like that's sick triangulation you know, no one's happy for anybody.
Speaker 1:No one, you know it's yeah, and that just was never who I was Like. I was always my sibling's biggest cheerleader, so that is that's hard.
Speaker 2:It is I want to read to you. Obviously, you know it's your book, duh. I want to read to you your own book, but in chapter eight, to feel or freeze, to fight or flee, do not avoid your suffering. Are you telling people to come face to face with their?
Speaker 1:sufferings. My Aunt, pat, wrote that and, yes, that's exactly what she was saying.
Speaker 2:Why do you think that's important?
Speaker 1:Because the only way through, the only way to get through the trauma is to go through the trauma, is to go through the pain. It's the only way. You can run as fast as you want from it or try to jump over it or sidestep it or whatever, and it's always going to find you. So you know. I have it tattooed on my arm. The only way out is through.
Speaker 2:Is that something that you're still working on?
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's never. I probably Really I think, yeah, yeah, and that was interesting too when the book came out and I started doing interviews and I felt like I needed to show up and show up as, like this healed version of myself.
Speaker 1:You know, I felt I was putting the pressure on myself, but I realized that it's all. My journey is just all steps, and sometimes they're a step backwards and sometimes it's 10 steps forwards, and so sometimes I'll have a memory that is, you know, overcomes me, and it takes me a few months to get myself back together and I just have accepted that that is my journey on this planet and what happened to me is a really big part of my journey on this planet, and I accept.
Speaker 2:I accept the challenge, yeah, I accept the challenge, but also that's interesting you said that you know it's this oh, healed version of me, but also people think that there has to be this forgiven version of you as well, and you talk about this on your Instagram. I love that you were talking about I don't have to forgive, like, how do you forgive someone like that? And I know a lot of clinicians promote forgiveness and I, too, have to agree with you that sometimes not forgiving feels so hella good, yeah, and I just don't want to forgive you. Well, it's also.
Speaker 1:What's the deal here? It's not. You know, I've, like, quoted Dr Romney a million times, but she writes about it in her book. It's Not you which is, and it makes perfect sense. If you keep forgiving somebody who keeps hurting you or abusing you, it's bad for your mental health, which makes perfect sense. It's like one person in my family would do something and say they were sorry, and then I would say it's okay, and then there was no change behavior and then they would do something like it again and again and again, and I was constantly like it's okay, it's okay, but you can't say you're sorry and not change the behavior. If the behavior is still happening, the abuse is still happening.
Speaker 1:So I believe in forgiveness. I just don't believe in it for every situation. And for the situation like what my grandfather did to me, I do not forgive him and I don't. That doesn't. And it's funny because people get so and I think it's because it's just so in their head. It's like, if you don't forgive, you're. And it's funny because people get so and I think it's because it's just so in their head. It's like if you don't forgive, you're just going to be angry, like people have written me things like forgive for yourself because you're just so angry and you're going to hold the resentment.
Speaker 1:I'm like I'm not angry, I'm not well. I shouldn't say that. Of course there's a part of me that's angry for what he did to me, but for what he did to me. But I'm not sitting in my anger. It comes and it goes, like every other feeling, and if I forgave him, that is not going to go away. Actually, for me it would—it just—it doesn't—I don't connect with that. I don't understand it.
Speaker 2:I absolutely agree with you. I also hate when they say forgiveness is very godly. Yeah, that just irks me the wrong way because it's like no, it's between me and God. Don't tell me, don't gaslight me into feeling like forgiveness, I can't forgive it. There's something wrong with me that means I'm default or like I'm an angry individual and I can't forgive. I'm sure you know what I'm talking about. You're a very forgiving individual, but there's just some people who you don't deserve that.
Speaker 1:But also what I find when that happens. When people say things like that, they're dismissing what happened to you. A hundred percent.
Speaker 1:So, it's like forgive. No one's talking about what the person did to you. They're talking about what are you doing to fix it. It's like, no, this person did A, b, c and D. I've chosen not to forgive them. I'm still doing the work on myself so that I can heal and get through it and be the best version of myself. And that doesn't come with forgiving this person. It's just. It's yeah, it's a very bad narrative.
Speaker 2:I agree, I don't know. I just I never, I've never pushed anybody to forgive. Yeah, and you never know. Sometimes you go, you know, come to that conclusion yourself. It's a journey, but don't ever push yourself. And sometimes it becomes very apparent who isn't doing the work on themselves.
Speaker 1:And it can be very jarring to go out in public situations. Yeah, but my husband I have my husband. For 12 years We've been married and I have a daughter who's now 10. And he's been so supportive of all, have a daughter who's now 10. And he's been so supportive of all of this. And it's really interesting, he's never come to see me speak ever, except last month.
Speaker 1:We went to Arizona to speak at Joe Polish Genius Network in Arizona and that was really interesting because my husband is a really calm, like healthy, non-traumatized person.
Speaker 1:I'm not sure how I got him to marry me, but it's interesting.
Speaker 1:But anyway, I did about a two-hour interview in front of a live audience and one of the first people that got up to ask a question asked it to my husband Really and they said I want to know how you're doing. And they gave him the mic and he just started bawling no and he couldn't get any words out and I didn't realize until that moment how much this has impacted him and how much I wasn't giving him enough credit for just being who he is and who the person that he's been for me in this situation since I've met him, but especially the last three years of just the roller coaster of everything that's gone on. So that was really a beautiful moment for us, because I was able to acknowledge like okay, this has really affected him, and he was, you know, when he stopped crying. He, he's a stuntman, has well, he directs now, but he's a stuntman for a long time and he's like this is harder than jumping off a building and he just said yeah, and he just said I, you know he's.
Speaker 1:It's like I've always said to her she's the strongest person I know and you know. But yeah, it takes a toll on your marriage when you have, and I think that that's why it's so important for people who are in relationship with people who've had trauma like big T trauma, especially to also get support themselves from other people that isn't their spouse, because it's hard on them too it does.
Speaker 2:It is hard on the family. Yeah, have you ever told your daughter?
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's interesting because she's an old soul and she's been here. Well, she actually told me she's been here. She's 400 years old, she told me.
Speaker 2:Oh my gosh.
Speaker 1:And actually I was going like to do a retreat with Dr Schwartz. And she's like why can't I come? And I said because it's for adults, honey and mommies go. I always tell her I'm like mommy's going so I can be a better mom. And she's like, well, I'm 400 years old, I'm old enough to go. I was like I know, but you're in, a one's really going to want you. How did you guys come to the terms with her soul being 400? That's fascinating. She's always been very connected to the other side, always, always, like always.
Speaker 1:And what kind of started me separating myself from my family was we all happened to be in New York at the same time two years ago. My book was not out yet. My mother was at that time living close to me and helping me with my daughter and there was some already struggles going on with me and some of my family members because of the book. And we were all in New York at the same time and I reached out to one of my siblings and said my daughter really wants to see her cousins. Can we just put things aside for the day and go to the beach, which you know, so that she can? She's really asking. And my sibling wrote back and said yes, absolutely.
Speaker 1:Well, you know with social media, you know where everybody is and they're posting. They're at. You know, they're at the beach, they're at the beach. No one's calling me, no one's calling me back. My daughter is in tears posting they're at the beach, they're at the beach. No one's calling me, no one's calling me back. My daughter is in tears, like what did I do, mommy? What did I do? Why don't they like me? And that was the biggest pivotal moment for me, where I was like not her, you're not going to do this to my daughter. Not even a sliver of what this family has been through is going to bleed on her, and they were doing that because they're angry at me.
Speaker 2:And so now she loses out.
Speaker 1:And so it was in that moment where I just had to say to her Capri mommy's family is really hurt and sometimes just because people are adults does not mean they behave right and this has absolutely nothing to do with you and everything to do with them and what they're going through. And that's when I really started to pull away from everybody, Because I just saw such a small, what seems like such a small thing, like she wasn't invited to the beach and how that affected her, and I was like, oh yeah, no.
Speaker 1:She's not going to spend a lifetime thinking she's not good enough because my traumatized family can't get their heads out of their asses.
Speaker 2:Yeah, exactly, Do you? No for sure. Do you recommend the individuals that have had trauma in their life, the big T trauma, do you? And they're still living with the abusers? Do you feel that it's a good idea for them to leave?
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, right, of course, because healing.
Speaker 2:you can't go to a therapist heal and then be exposed to the same environment.
Speaker 1:It's like no, but I also know how difficult that is.
Speaker 1:And everybody's situation is different. And you know, I have people in my family that are still close with people that are abusing them and they'll probably live that way forever. And if you're not and I hate to say if you're not strong enough, because I don't think it's like if you're not strong enough I think it's just that you're conditioned to believe that you deserve it in some way. And even if you can say to yourself that you know you don't deserve it, there's something inside of you that feels like you do. It's like I spent most of my 20s with horrible and horrible relationships, because that's all I knew. That's the relationship I didn't have. I didn't have any man in my life to show me what a healthy, loving relationship looked like.
Speaker 1:So I seeked out bad partner after bad partner and that's just what happens. So it's not about being strong enough, I don't think. I think that, actually, trauma survivors are the most strongest people on the planet. I think it's just getting to a point where you can choose you, and I know how hard that can be.
Speaker 2:It definitely can be that loving yourself piece. What does that look like for you?
Speaker 1:It looks like being and, I have to say, since I am not in relationship again with anybody in my family or anybody who's been abusive to me in my life, and whatever level of abuse that is that I can finally show up as my authentic self all the time, every day, with everybody that I'm in relationship with, and for years I was playing a part to every single person in my family to make them happy. Oh my God, and that's….
Speaker 2:It's exhausting. How did you heal from that? How did you do that? It's exhausting.
Speaker 1:It's all I knew. It's all I knew. I'm like, okay, this is… I can't say this around this person. I have to be careful about doing this around this person. So I'm going to, you know, and when we go to this person's house, I can't. I mean, it was crazy and I remember when we were actually in New York. At the time, one of my siblings reached out to me and said you can drop your daughter off. This is how, like whoa, you can drop your daughter off. This is how, like whoa, you can drop your daughter off at my house. We're happy to have her, but you can't come in. And I was like, wow, you guys are so fucked up, I don't even have words.
Speaker 2:How do you say to that?
Speaker 1:Well, I said wrong person, Like and that's literally that's when my relationship stopped with 90% of them, and my mom was the last, but like that was one of my sisters. Like you know, your daughter is welcome at our house, but you're not. I'm like, oh yeah, because that's what I'm going to do, Drop my daughter off at your house and just like leave. What I mean? But to be able to say that out loud and think it's okay just shows you how traumatized everybody is and toxic everybody is and all of those things. When you're doing the work on yourself and they're said to you and you're just like, yeah, I'm not that person anymore, that's like the difference, right, when you've really done the work on yourself and you cannot be in a relationship with somebody anymore who is doing those things to you, it's a really freeing place to be at. My piece is way too expensive.
Speaker 2:It's expensive, but it's also, I'm sure it took a lot of work for you to get there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I just I think that you know they took away most of my younger years, so I'd like to still look good and live in a good space for a little while.
Speaker 2:I hear you, I hear you. Oh, my God, you know the things like this age your soul Totally so badly. Yeah, it could just make you feel so drained and tired. And then I mean, did you ever find yourself comparing to others, other people? Oh yeah, all the time.
Speaker 1:You still do that? No, thank God. No, I'm like proud of other people when they accomplish things. When I first became a stuntwoman, I was any girl that came into the business that was my size was a threat to me. Really, yeah, I was like you know who's this bitch Like? Who does she think she is?
Speaker 1:You know kind of thing when now I'm, I mean, but that was my insecurities, that was me not feeling like I'm good enough to be where I was and questioning if someone was going to come take it all away from me, Because anytime anything good happened to me, that's how I felt Like I don't deserve this, it's going to be taken from me. So that's where it stemmed from, it wasn't you know where. Now it's like I can be happy for people and you know, and that lasted a short time the you know you're a bitch, what are you doing here? Kind of thing. But it was there. You know, it was definitely there. Bitch, what are you doing here?
Speaker 2:Kind of thing, but it was there. You know, it was definitely there, have you? You said your grandfather has passed away. Oh yeah, have you wrote a letter to him? Oh God no.
Speaker 1:Would you ever want to? No, I don't really have anything to say.
Speaker 2:Like a conclusion.
Speaker 1:I mean, maybe, who knows, I don't really have anything to say. My grandmother stayed alive for a really long time. So he died when I was 11 and my grandmother didn't die until I. Well, she died eight years ago, so she lived till she was like 99. It was ridiculous. I was like when is this girl, when is this lady going to die? When is this girl? I was like, die, die, bitch. What is happening? No, for real, she hung on and I don't know how she hung on for so long, because With a husband like that, well, not only that, she was such an interesting human, if you even want to call her a human, because she admitted everything.
Speaker 1:You know, he left confession letters. So she found the confession letters when he died. My goodness, she read them. She was very aware. She was aware before he died, she was aware all the time, and she would have conversations with me where she would just say I never, I know, I believe you, I believe everything you're saying to me, and then she would drink from a mug that said I love my husband and wear his wedding band around her neck. She was crazy, out of her mind. I mean, he was very, he was. I think he like checks all the boxes of the psychopath, which is out to the public.
Speaker 1:He was this model Charming citizen and charming, and everybody loved him and he made a bunch of money as an architect, but he wasn't actually an architect, which is what I found out in the last 10 years of my life that he worked for an architect and then, when the guy died, he assumed his license but he never actually passed his architectural test. So he was never actually an architect, but he acted like he was one and it's, I mean, his whole life was just a lie. Would I like to sit down in a room with him? Yeah, you would. Yeah, what would you tell him I? I, or what would you do? I mean, well, before I killed him, I'd have some questions, but I feel like I, With your acrobatic skills, yeah, but I, it's. You know, it's interesting.
Speaker 1:Have you heard of Marilyn Murray? Yeah, yeah, so she just read my book and called me. You know she's like 87. She's amazing, yeah, and she used to work in the prisons with men that abuse like psychopaths, and that's fascinating to me because she obviously she was abused and she has her own story, and an amazing story at that, and the fact that she was able to work with them to me is. I don't think that's something I could do.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's severe exposure to another level, like you have to be so ready to face men like your abuser.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and she did for so many years. Yeah, I think I'm going to meet her next month when I go back to Arizona.
Speaker 2:Yeah, how did you find this self-love? How did I find? My self-love the self-love, the self-appreciation, finding it? It's tough finding it. No, I'm still finding it.
Speaker 1:You're still finding it. I've always appreciated myself. I've always loved myself. I just didn't know how to. I always had a love for myself, like I could look in the mirror and feel like I was beautiful. And when I say that I don't mean externally, I mean I liked the person. I've always liked who I am. I never didn't like who I was. It was just really confused with all of the things that had happened to me and so I didn't. It took me a long time to find my authentic self, or to be able to be true to my authentic self. I think I always knew who she was, but it's taken me a long time to get like to peel it all away, and I think I'll probably be peeling it away for a long time.
Speaker 2:So, which is okay, it is okay, have you made peace with your inner child? Yeah, I think that's such a honorable work to do with a clinician.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and parent your inner child. Do you do a lot of inner child work with your clients.
Speaker 2:It's my favorite it is. It's very rewarding Such a like noble thing to do to do?
Speaker 1:yeah, well, they're the ones that went through it all yeah and survived it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and for a long time I was very angry with her. Like it's and I speak about this in the book I'd see pictures of her and just be like, why didn't you in my head like, why didn't you fight back? Why didn't you in my head like, why didn't you fight back? Why didn't you do anything? And now that I'm connected with her, that was literally my first journey. She just was like in front of me and she put her hand out for me to hold her hand and she was smiling and she was in one of the dresses that I was abused in.
Speaker 1:That I have a very big memory connected to. And she's just smiling with her hand out and I couldn't like I'm working with my doctor at the same time but I couldn't grab her hand. I'm like I can't grab her hand, I can't grab her hand, and so that was my entire journey was just that I was able to grab her hand. Then I couldn't walk with her. Then I was able to walk with her and then at the end she just the two things she said to me was what?
Speaker 1:took me so long, oh my goodness. Which is so me at 10. And she said I just want you to know, and at this time I still had a relationship with my mom.
Speaker 2:She said I just want you to know mommy's never going to get it. Wow yeah. So, she needed you to get it. Yeah, are you? Are you doing a better job parenting her? Now then yeah, yeah how do you? How do you?
Speaker 1:parent her. Now I think that cutting ties with my mom was the biggest, safest thing that I could have done for her, because what I realized is she never felt safe with my mom and why would she? And so I think every time I was around my mom, I was this heightened version of myself that felt like I needed to protect myself, and so always feeling like you're in fight or flight around your own mother is exhausting, and I think she couldn't fully connect with me until I did that for her, and once I did, I feel like she lives here and she's just here with me, where before I felt like we were separate.
Speaker 2:And she's so lovely, yeah, and special, yeah, and I'm so happy that you've connected with her. That's like the most liberating and hard. Yeah, it's not easy getting to that level. When you were in therapy or healing, did you ever want to quit?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I did quit, you did yeah Because that work is tough.
Speaker 2:We all quit right.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, yeah that exposure sucks, yeah, and for a long time I was trying to do therapy with my like. I do my own therapy, then I go to therapy with my mom and Really Try to.
Speaker 2:That must have been draining, it was so draining.
Speaker 1:I was going backwards, I was doing all of, but I needed to do it to get where I am now.
Speaker 2:I know that.
Speaker 1:It was part of the journey. I needed to exhaust every possible thing with my mom so that I could sit with my inner child and say I get it Like she always knew it. Yeah, but my adult self wanted the mother that I never had, and I was trying so hard to get something from my mom that she didn't have to give, and I think that's where people get stuck so much. Oh, yeah, it's that hope, yeah, it's the trying so hard Like if they just do this or if I just do this, she'll get it and things will be different, she'll change, and most of the time it's just not what happens.
Speaker 2:No, and that's the unfortunate piece that people are like should I come with my husband? Should I come with my mom? They'll change. Maybe you'll say something. And it's like that's not how it works. If you're traumatized to that level, you run the heck out of there. Yeah. Because, that's when the real healing starts. You know, Kimberly, thank you so much for today.
Speaker 2:Thank you, it's been like an hour of an intense conversation, but I'm so honored that you're comfortable to speak about this and change so many people with your story. Before we go, what's one advice you would give? I'm sure you've been asked this question like 7,000 times.
Speaker 1:Yeah, maybe in different ways To a big T person that is just, and is still going through it. What's an advice?
Speaker 2:you can give person that is just and is still going through it. What's an advice you can give?
Speaker 1:My advice is to is it starts with connecting with your inner child, and the only way you can do that is around safe people, and most of the time when we've been abused in our family, our family is not our safe people and that's the saddest, hardest thing to come to terms with and look at. But until you're able to do that, nothing is really going to truly shift.
Speaker 2:Before we go. I know that you have an event coming up with Dr Gabor. Can you tell us about that, because this is going to be phenomenal.
Speaker 1:Yes, we're doing an event in Santa Monica on October 6th. It's an all-day event from 10 to 5. It's called Return to Self Navigating Attachment and Authenticity, and I'm so honored to share the stage with him. I mean to even be in the same hemisphere with him and all of the work he's done with trauma. If people aren't familiar with his work, it will change your life. It will change your life to hear him speak live, because it changed mine when I heard him speak live.
Speaker 1:And the attachment, authenticity, is exactly what I was just talking about. Is that? And that's literally the first thing he said to me when I met him is he said, okay, I was pitching for him to endorse my book and he said, yes, when you're done, give it to me and if it speaks to me. And he said I just want to tell you that your first trauma was not your sexual abuse. He's like, I'm not taking that away from you, he's like but your first trauma was that you were cut off from all adult support, which is how the abuse happened in the first place. And that's the attachment right.
Speaker 1:So I didn't have a healthy attachment to my parents, which is how the abuse happened and so many people are trying to navigate that.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah.
Speaker 1:And so I think this event is going to be really, really powerful.
Speaker 2:It's powerful and it's going to definitely change a lot of lives because it does put a lot of things into perspective for individuals. So very, very happy that you're going to do this with Gabor and I can't wait to see you. Thank you, thank you, thank you Appreciate it.
Speaker 1:Thank you.